<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #1489</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	12/13/99 6:31:01 PM Pacific Standard Time<BR>
From:	owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>
Sender:	owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Reply-to:	traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
To:	traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10><BR>
</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10><BR>
Traveller-digest     Monday, December 13 1999     Volume 1999 : Number 1489<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Traveller News Service<BR>
Re: Mass communication, the nobility and epistemology (LONG)<BR>
Re: South Park's Cartman as a Imperial Noble<BR>
Re: technology advances<BR>
Re: Handouts<BR>
Re: The Rise and Supposed Decline of the RPG Empire<BR>
Re: My new SF miniatures site is up!<BR>
Re: Deserts<BR>
Re: South Park's Cartman as a Imperial Noble<BR>
Re: Paintball is not a real gun, much less a light crew served weapon<BR>
re:  Silly Traveller<BR>
Re: Deserts (wwas re: the stresses of being a grunt)<BR>
Re: Superpowers<BR>
Re: Superpowers & Photosynthesis<BR>
Re: Superpowers & Photosynthesis<BR>
Re: My new SF miniatures site is up!<BR>
Re: South Park's Cartman as a Imperial Noble<BR>
Re: Starting Traveller Newbies, Handouts<BR>
Re: Velocity/Vector<BR>
Full auto Pilgramage Pics...and DITZIE?!?!<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 19:12:00 EST<BR>
From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller News Service<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 12/13/99 11:32:26 AM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>
gridlore@pop.mindspring.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
> >What other duke in living memory has defended the Imperium from invasion <BR>
by <BR>
>  >hostile empires?<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Since the aging rolls at TL 12 begin at something like 110, and aganthetic<BR>
>  drugs are available, I suppose all those guys in Sol Sector might be<BR>
>  clearing their throats about now.<BR>
<BR>
Urrr, not really.  Technically the Solomani Rim War was a civil war.<BR>
<BR>
>  Was Norris Duke during the Fourth War?<BR>
<BR>
According to _Behind the Claw_, he was invested as Duke in 1098.<BR>
<BR>
- ----------<BR>
Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>
writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>
"For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>
set of people who will take offense at it."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 17:13:47 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Mass communication, the nobility and epistemology (LONG)<BR>
<BR>
Kiri Aradia Morgan wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
 <BR>
> But I myself was not permitted entry into an amusement park (Great<BR>
> America) until I walked all the way back to my then-husband's car with our<BR>
> keychains, removed the mini-knockoff Swiss Army knives, the longest blades<BR>
> upon which were 1.5" long, and locked them in the car.  A folding knife<BR>
> with a 1.5" blade was considered a weapon, despite the fact that it's<BR>
> really no good for anything other than cutting tape on boxes and slitting<BR>
> open envelopes, etc.<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
Hey, the last time I was at one of those, I very nearly had to strip<BR>
down before they finally conceded that it was the button on my pants<BR>
tripping the alarms.<BR>
<BR>
To be fair, they'd had an incident the week before where some banger<BR>
stabbed another banger, so they cranked up the sensitivity on the metal<BR>
detectors to 'Absurd'...I wasn't the only one getting caught by the<BR>
things. <BR>
<BR>
Besides <assume meanacing psycho voice> I know 250 ways to kill you with<BR>
a tiny knife blade like that...<BR>
<BR>
Of course, most of them involve things like: "I slit the tape holding<BR>
the box with the loaded mac-10 together", "I use it to strip the wires<BR>
on the detonator for the C4", "I 'accidentally' drop it from LEO on<BR>
you"... so they're not likely to be applicable in all situations...<BR>
<BR>
:-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 19:13:48 -0500 (EST)<BR>
From: Kenji Schwarz <schwarz@fas.harvard.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: South Park's Cartman as a Imperial Noble<BR>
<BR>
On Sun, 12 Dec 1999, Volker Greimann wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >Cartman is clearly Lucan.<BR>
> ><BR>
> ><Cartman voice> I'm the emperor! Respect my authori-ty! </Cartman voice><BR>
> ><BR>
> ><BR>
> >I would compare Stan to Archduke Norris, but I am trying to purge the <BR>
> >thought of Norris vomiting whenever approached by a future Archduchess.<BR>
> And Kenny would be Brzk, I guess. I mean, who can really understand an <BR>
> Imperial Vargr, right?<BR>
<BR>
Brainstorm!  <BR>
<BR>
Big Gay Al is OBVIOUSLY Grandfather!  Remember his pocket universe in the<BR>
suitcase?  <BR>
<BR>
Kenji<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 11:22:31 +1000<BR>
From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>
Subject: Re: technology advances<BR>
<BR>
Dear Folks -<BR>
<BR>
Kyle wrote:<BR>
>The Americans may have the<BR>
>resources, but the Commonwealth has the brains!<BR>
<BR>
Dunno about that, when the Brits decided to drop our joint spaceflight program<BR>
at Woomera, P.M. Menzies agreed on the grounds that we should only produce wool<BR>
and wheat...<BR>
<BR>
Man - that annoys me! We were testing salvaged V2's and had advanced to<BR>
producing "Blue Streak", then they came and broke them and the gantry's etc up<BR>
for scrap. Oz could have been making a fortune on satellites by now.<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson        Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>
http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw                       davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>
"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material & opinions contained within are solely those<BR>
of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>
position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 11:24:57 +1000<BR>
From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>
Subject: Re: Handouts<BR>
<BR>
Dear Folks -<BR>
<BR>
Kyle said:<BR>
>...you'll often find cds of sound effects,<BR>
>everything from karate kicks to explosions to - well,<BR>
>farts.<BR>
>This sort of thing can really help set the mood.<BR>
>Though what mood you'd be going for with the last<BR>
>sound, I'm not sure...<BR>
<BR>
HePlaR?<BR>
<BR>
- - Hyphen<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 16:33:24 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: The Rise and Supposed Decline of the RPG Empire<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 11:46 PM 12/12/1999 PST, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>>>"What star does Krypton orbit?" :-)<BR>
>>><BR>
>>> Oh, I'd give it to them.. since Kryptonians don't have powers under the<BR>
>>> giant red sun....<BR>
>><BR>
>>Yeah, but aside from exporting Kryptonian merc units, can you imagine<BR>
>>what the (old-style DC) Kryptonian technology could do for your<BR>
>>players. <BR>
><BR>
> Canonically, Kryptonian leaders shunned the concept of space flight,<BR>
> refusing to allow Jor-El to build more than the prototype that took Kal-el<BR>
> to Earth.  So the munchkin colonists show up, and all their ships get<BR>
> zotted into the Phantom Zone.<BR>
><BR>
> "Welcome to Krypton, have a toga."<BR>
<BR>
I said *old style*. Before that atrocity of a movie, and before Brunner<BR>
and company re-wrote the entire history. <BR>
<BR>
Krypton *had* space flight. At least as far as one of their (several)<BR>
moons. And they didn't wear togas. Instead they wore colorful outfits<BR>
and the men wore these neat headbands.<BR>
<BR>
The problem was that there weren't any other planets in their solar<BR>
system. Hence Jor-el had to go straight from "local" spaceflight to<BR>
interstellar flight in one leap.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 16:42:37 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: My new SF miniatures site is up!<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> So, my total cost for these shots was the price of development. Not too bad!<BR>
> Especially considering that I can't buy a digital camera capable of taking<BR>
> these shots.<BR>
<BR>
Actually the "toy" "computer microscope" from Intel/Mattel, the QX-3<BR>
should be able to do miniatures shots quite well given the shots they<BR>
show it making. Looks to be capable of "macro lens" type shots on down<BR>
to (low power) microscopic. <BR>
<BR>
I'll be checking the toy stores *after* Christmas.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 16:19:38 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Deserts<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> "Eris Reddoch" <eris@pcola.gulf.net> wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>Personally, I don't care whether it's F or C, if it's a negative<BR>
>>number it's too cold for me.  I'm one of those people Cynthia was<BR>
>>talking about...sweaters at 60F, thick coats at 50F, mittens,<BR>
>>earmuffs and layered clothes at 40F, huddle around the stove at 30F,<BR>
>>and if it gets colder than that it's time to migrate further south!<BR>
<BR>
Do keep in mind that negative numbers for C start at just below 32 F. <BR>
Here's a handy equivalence chart that takes advantage of the fact that<BR>
9 F degrees are the same size as 5 C degrees<BR>
<BR>
F	C<BR>
- ----	----<BR>
212	100 	water boils<BR>
203	 95<BR>
194	 90<BR>
185	 85<BR>
176	 80<BR>
167	 75<BR>
158	 70<BR>
149	 65<BR>
140	 60<BR>
131	 55<BR>
122	 50<BR>
113	 45<BR>
104	 40<BR>
 98.6	 37<BR>
 95	 35<BR>
 86	 30<BR>
 77	 25<BR>
 68	 20<BR>
 59	 15<BR>
 50	 10<BR>
 41	  5<BR>
 32	  0	water freezes<BR>
 23	 -5<BR>
 14	-10<BR>
  5	-15<BR>
 -4	-20<BR>
- -13	-25<BR>
- -22	-30<BR>
- -31	-35<BR>
- -40	-40<BR>
- -49	-45<BR>
- -58	-50<BR>
- -67	-55<BR>
- -76	-60<BR>
- -85	-65<BR>
- -94	-70<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 19:38:37 -0500<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: Re: South Park's Cartman as a Imperial Noble<BR>
<BR>
From: Kenji Schwarz <schwarz@fas.harvard.edu><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> Big Gay Al is OBVIOUSLY Grandfather!  Remember his pocket<BR>
>universe in the suitcase?<BR>
<BR>
You, sir, are a keyboard destroying bastard... <mumble> I guess I deserved<BR>
it for calling into question your... uhm... bravery on the Traveller-Culture<BR>
list!<BR>
<BR>
<going off to find paper towels><BR>
<BR>
If my space bar sticks, so help me!<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 19:59:09 -0500<BR>
From: "Terry Carlino" <carlino@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Paintball is not a real gun, much less a light crew served weapon<BR>
<BR>
>>> You know... Paint Balls don't have to contain paint....<BR>
>><BR>
>> But you'd want to handle them more carefully if they contained something<BR>
>> dangerous !<BR>
><BR>
>I already covered "explosives". <BR>
><BR>
>But it just occured to me that some PC out the *has* to be carrying a<BR>
>paintball gun with "napalm" ammo. Though I admit it'd be more likely in<BR>
>a White Wolf type game. <BR>
<BR>
Holy water. To fight Vampires you load your paintballs with Holy Water.<BR>
<BR>
Terry C<BR>
All that is Gold does not glitter<BR>
Not all who travel are lost <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 17:16:17 -0800 (PST)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: re:  Silly Traveller<BR>
<BR>
>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
<BR>
>I just watched "Raiders of the Lost Ark" again last<BR>
>night. <BR>
<BR>
I caught part of it on Saturday night, but had to<BR>
leave at the boxing match beside the pusher-prop<BR>
German airplane.<BR>
<BR>
>The PCs have found an *old* Solomani ship, say from <BR>
>the period of the original wars with the Ziru Sirka. <BR>
<BR>
>It's got something stenciled on it in what may be an <BR>
>old version of Galanglic. It's rather cryptic.	<BR>
<BR>
>Yes. *That* crate. :-)<BR>
<BR>
I don't know if I'd give it to the PCs right away;<BR>
after all, they might all just be killed as soon as<BR>
they opened it, like in the movie.  Maybe it should be<BR>
a race between the Solomani, who want to use it in the<BR>
next Solomani Rim War, and the Imperium, who send the<BR>
PCs to steal it back?<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Thousands of Stores.  Millions of Products.  All in one place.<BR>
Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 12 Dec 1999 11:10:33 -0500<BR>
From: Bradley L Houston <brhoust@juno.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Deserts (wwas re: the stresses of being a grunt)<BR>
<BR>
When I was in Saudi Arabia and Iraq it got very cold at night too.  <BR>
<BR>
Same for here in Phoenix at night.<BR>
<BR>
Brad<BR>
<BR>
On Fri, 10 Dec 1999 22:39:20 EST Sethkimmel@aol.com writes:<BR>
> In a message dated 12/9/99 6:23:01 AM Pacific Standard Time, <BR>
> SmithW@HARTWICK.EDU writes:<BR>
> <BR>
> << While I'll agree with you on the mosquito nets, don't most <BR>
> deserts<BR>
>  get pretty chilly at night?<BR>
>  <BR>
>  Or is that just North Africa? >><BR>
> <BR>
> Get's pretty f*****g cold here in Vegas at night in the winter...:-)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 16:46:17 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Superpowers<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>> Actually carbon is radioactive, this property is used when carbon<BR>
>> dating an item. You measure the ratio of carbon 14 to carbon 12 the<BR>
>> more carbon 14 you have the newer it is. Carbon has a long half life<BR>
>> (it decays slowly) but would still set the sensors off at<BR>
>> Sellafield.  And you wouldn't want to be there if it did!<BR>
<BR>
> Um, Carbon-14 has a 5700 year half life. Since the coal deposits are over<BR>
> 100 million years old (460 million comes to mind) there is no problem<BR>
> from that cause.<BR>
><BR>
> IIRC, carbon 14 dating assumes that the living matter is continually<BR>
> absorbing carbon 14 from the environment. A process that stops as soon as<BR>
> the thing dies.<BR>
<BR>
Which is why one of the "Biblical literalist" arguments against carbon<BR>
dating is such a bad joke. They gleefully point out that a sample from<BR>
a plastic comb reads as half a million years old. <BR>
<BR>
Well, actually, it readfs out as "older than we can measure". Which is<BR>
reasonable enough given that the carbon in plastics comes from coal or<BR>
oil and has thus been dead for milions of years. <sigh><BR>
<BR>
> The above does not imply that I know what the source of carbon 14 in the<BR>
> environment is.<BR>
<BR>
Cosmic rays converted N-14 to C-14 at a fairly steady rate. Tree ring<BR>
matching has let them calibrate the scale back to around 10,000 BC.<BR>
There aren't any trees that old, but they can match growth patterns in<BR>
the inner rings of old trees with patterns in the outer rings of<BR>
stumps. Then you match the pattens in the inner parts of those with<BR>
older stumps. <BR>
<BR>
From this, they've determined that the cosmic ray flux *does vary<BR>
measurably on thousand year timescales.<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 16:55:36 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Superpowers & Photosynthesis<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Speaking of photosynthesis:<BR>
> The photosynthesis process requires chlorofil to be present for the <BR>
> convertion from carbon dioxide to oxygen. Does this mean that all plants on <BR>
> all Traveller planets with oxygen/carbon dioxide atmospheres are green. Or <BR>
> is it possible to substitute chlorofil for another substance and end up with <BR>
> blue/red/any colour plants that perform the same function?<BR>
<BR>
There are organisms on *earth* that use something other than<BR>
chlorphyll. But they tend to be "primitive algae, as chlorophyll is<BR>
*very* efficient, even though it reflects light near the peak of Sol's<BR>
light output curve. <BR>
<BR>
But with different stars and different environments, other chemicals<BR>
*are* possible. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 16:58:23 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Superpowers & Photosynthesis<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
>>Speaking of photosynthesis:<BR>
>>The photosynthesis process requires chlorofil to be present for<BR>
>>the convertion from carbon dioxide to oxygen. Does this mean that<BR>
>>all plants on all Traveller planets with oxygen/carbon dioxide<BR>
>>atmospheres are green. Or is it possible to substitute chlorofil<BR>
>>for another substance and end up with blue/red/any colour plants<BR>
>>that perform the same function?<BR>
><BR>
>         Chlorophyll is the most important photosynthetic pigment<BR>
>         found here on Terra, but there are other pigments involved<BR>
>         in many species.  The various colours that leaves take on<BR>
>         in the fall, in temperate climes, are caused by these<BR>
>         pigments.<BR>
<BR>
Those pigments are always there, but they *don't* take part in<BR>
photosynthesis. <BR>
<BR>
> I would expect to see photosynthetic structures<BR>
>         of different colours, depending on the wavelengths of light<BR>
>         that arrive.<BR>
<BR>
Wavelength isn't as important as you'd think. Remember, chlorophyll is<BR>
green because it *reflects* green light. And that's practically at the<BR>
peak of Sol's emmission spectrm (ie the strongest single wavelngth in<BR>
the mix).<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 17:30:42 -0800 (PST)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: My new SF miniatures site is up!<BR>
<BR>
>From: Timothy.Collinson@solent.ac.uk<BR>
<BR>
>Do you have any idea what RAM stands for though?<BR>
<BR>
(Many voices intoning at once:)  <BR>
<BR>
Rocket Assisted Munitions.<BR>
<BR>
See Book 4, Mercenary, for a good discussion.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Thousands of Stores.  Millions of Products.  All in one place.<BR>
Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 21:00:07 -0500<BR>
From: "pould" <pould@netcom.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: South Park's Cartman as a Imperial Noble<BR>
<BR>
I also have something scary to reveal... I have set aside for a few months<BR>
the Traveller campaign and we are playing a game of Deadlands.  Without<BR>
knowing (I know very little about the geography of the USA), I set the game<BR>
in Colorado in 1876.  I found an 1895 map of Colorado on the net (a very<BR>
nice map) and a lit of counties.  ONe of the counties is named Park County.<BR>
On the map, the area is known as South Park.  We have been stucked in an<BR>
evil loop of jokes about undead Sheriff Kenny and some of my players refer<BR>
to their guns as their "cowlaunchers".<BR>
<BR>
Daniel Poulin<BR>
pould@netcom.ca<BR>
<BR>
- ----- Message d'origine -----<BR>
De : Kenji Schwarz <schwarz@fas.harvard.edu><BR>
 : <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Envoy : 13 dcembre, 1999 19:13<BR>
Objet : Re: South Park's Cartman as a Imperial Noble<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
> On Sun, 12 Dec 1999, Volker Greimann wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> > >Cartman is clearly Lucan.<BR>
> > ><BR>
> > ><Cartman voice> I'm the emperor! Respect my authori-ty! </Cartman<BR>
voice><BR>
> > ><BR>
> > ><BR>
> > >I would compare Stan to Archduke Norris, but I am trying to purge the<BR>
> > >thought of Norris vomiting whenever approached by a future Archduchess.<BR>
> > And Kenny would be Brzk, I guess. I mean, who can really understand an<BR>
> > Imperial Vargr, right?<BR>
><BR>
> Brainstorm!<BR>
><BR>
> Big Gay Al is OBVIOUSLY Grandfather!  Remember his pocket universe in the<BR>
> suitcase?<BR>
><BR>
> Kenji<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 17:47:09 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Starting Traveller Newbies, Handouts<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> It was a fantastic idea, and it worked really well with those two modules in<BR>
> particular. Then again, Tomb of Horrors is my favorite adventure of all<BR>
> time, although the sheer coolness of Expedition to the Barrier Peaks should<BR>
> not be underestimated.<BR>
<BR>
"Expedition to the Barrier Peaks" would make a great way to drag some<BR>
FRP characters into Traveller. :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 17:01:42 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Velocity/Vector<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Josh W. Spencer writes:<BR>
>>Hello.<BR>
>>This is probably considered an easy question: Does any ship<BR>
>>maintain its original velocity and vector when exiting jumpspace?<BR>
><BR>
>         Easy, no.  Thoroughly discussed on the TML, yes.  Opinions<BR>
>         vary, but some of the issues raised: Stars are moving relative<BR>
>         to each other, should this velocity be included?  Planets are<BR>
>         moving around stars, should this movement be included?<BR>
<BR>
If momentum is conserved by jump, then your velocity upon entering jump<BR>
*relative to a given object* will be the same as your velocity upon<BR>
exiting jump relative to the *same* object. Thus the question about "do<BR>
planetary orbital velocities count" is irrelevant. <BR>
<BR>
If you measured relative to the planet you left, then on exit you'd<BR>
measure relative to the position and velocity the planet had when you<BR>
jumped, not it's current velocity and position (both of which have<BR>
changed in the intervening week). <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
>  Can<BR>
>         freetraders accelerate all the way to 100 diameters, then jump<BR>
>         so that they will arrive headed into their destination planet?<BR>
>         (this would make intercepting ships at 100D very difficult)<BR>
<BR>
Don't forget that the time you spend in jump *varies*. That means that<BR>
if you aimed for a spot at the 100 diameter limit of the destination,<BR>
but emerged a day early (or a day late) the planet will be a *long*<BR>
ways away. For example, earth orbit's the sun at 30 km/sec. So in 24<BR>
hours it moves 2.6 *million* km. That's several hours away in normal<BR>
space. <BR>
<BR>
>         My own take is that velocity is conserved if you jump into<BR>
>         deep space (no substantial masses present), but the closer<BR>
>         that you are to a mass when you come out of jump, the closer<BR>
>         you are to conserving velocity /relative to that mass/.<BR>
<BR>
Which doesn't help, because conservation of momentum requires that the<BR>
before and after values be measured in the *same* reference frame. If<BR>
you teleport from earth (at rest with respect to Earth) and arrive at<BR>
rest with respect to Mars, you have to explain what happened to the<BR>
difference between the orbital velocities of Earth and Mars. You also<BR>
have to explain what happened to the difference in potential energy<BR>
(Earth is a lot deeper in the sun's gravity well and the surface of<BR>
Mars has a potential in it's *own* gravity well that's equvalent to<BR>
being one hell of a long ways above the surface of the Earth. And then<BR>
there's the differences in angular momentum. <BR>
<BR>
>         This has the practical effect that if you leave Regina at<BR>
>         25 km/sec (relative to Regina), you arrive at Ruie moving at<BR>
>         25 km/sec (relative to Ruie).  Of course, if the PCs want<BR>
>         more detail, the velocity at Ruie might be 25.02 km/sec if<BR>
>         the arrival distance from Ruie is different from the departure<BR>
>         distance from Regina (I include a large random element to<BR>
>         arrival location).<BR>
<BR>
Alas, since the two planets are almost certainly moving at different<BR>
velocities relative to each other, this *doesn't* solve the problem.<BR>
You still have to account for *that* velocity difference. <BR>
<BR>
In other words. you pick a reference point at the *start* of a<BR>
calculation and you have to keep measuring relative to that *point*<BR>
during the entire calculation. Since planets are moving in *curved*<BR>
paths, you can't use them as the reference point for any calculation<BR>
covering a period during which the change in the planet's velocity<BR>
vector is significant. It's *definitely* significant over a week!<BR>
<BR>
On the other hand, while stars are orbiting the galaxy, their orbits<BR>
are so long that *stellar* motion (in non-binary systems) can be<BR>
considered to be "striaght line" over periods of *years*. In binary<BR>
systems you use the center of mass of the system as the reference<BR>
point. <BR>
<BR>
So you can measure the ship's before and after velocity using one of<BR>
the star's as a reference point (or even a third star). This means you<BR>
need to know how fast and in what direction the stars are moving<BR>
relative to each other, and how fast the ship was moving relative to<BR>
the reference star. <BR>
<BR>
If it comes out of jump with the same velocity, then you get to convert<BR>
that into velocity relative to the target star. And then into velocity<BR>
relative to the target planet. <BR>
<BR>
Simplest dodge is to assume the stars are stationary with respect to<BR>
each other. In actuality, they might be moving at 50 km/sec relative to<BR>
each other. Give or take 10 or 20 km/sec. :-)<BR>
<BR>
Then you have to worry about motion of the planets. Since Traveller<BR>
uses "flat" maps so much, we might as well assume that the orbital<BR>
planes of the planets are aligned. It makes for easier calculations,<BR>
that's for sure!<BR>
<BR>
So now you need to worry about *where* in it's orbit the planet is.<BR>
After all, in midsummer it's moving with the same speed as in<BR>
midwinter(well, usually), but in the *opposite* direction.<BR>
<BR>
And the same goes for the destination planet. And it's unlikely to have<BR>
the same length year. <BR>
<BR>
It's actually fairly *easy* to add up all these velocity vectors.  Just<BR>
take a sheet of paper and *draw* the first vector. Make a starting<BR>
point and draw an arrow in the proper direction, with a length equal to<BR>
the speeds (say 1 mm for every km/sec of speed). So if the planet is<BR>
moving 30 km/sec at a 45 degree angle to rimward, draw a 30 mm line at<BR>
a 45 degree angle to which ever direction on the paper you've decided<BR>
rimward is. Now, let's say the second planet is moving at 23 km/sec at<BR>
75 degrees to rimward. You place the ruler at the *point* of the first<BR>
arrow, and lay it at 75 degrees to the rimward direction, then draw an<BR>
arrow 23 mm long. Finally, lay the ruler between the *start* of the<BR>
first arrow and the *end* of the second one. The speed is the distance<BR>
between those points. And the direction is the direction of the line<BR>
between them. <BR>
<BR>
If there are more vectors (say you have the stars moving relative to<BR>
each other) just add them in as more arrows. Just be sure that each new<BR>
arrow has its start (tail) at the *head* of the previous arrow, and<BR>
that you measure angles relative to the *same* side of the paper for<BR>
all the arrows. Then just draw a line from the tail of the first arrow<BR>
to the head of the last, and that's the sum of all those vectors. <BR>
<BR>
Believe me, it's one *hell* of a lot simpler than trying to *calculate*<BR>
all of the vectors!<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 18:10:39 -0800<BR>
From: Jesse DeGraff <jdegraff@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Full auto Pilgramage Pics...and DITZIE?!?!<BR>
<BR>
Head over to http://vision-forge-graphics.com/jesse/shooting/, then down to<BR>
the Dec 13th news, for pictures of Doug's & my trip to Oregon to have some<BR>
full auto fun with Mark Cook.<BR>
<BR>
Ditzie is apparently alive and well in Oregon =)   One of the girls at the<BR>
shoot could be an older Ditzie, and she was having FUN, with a capital F  U<BR>
N, shooting various firearms.  I'm referring to the one I named "Snow White"<BR>
(never got her real name).  You'll really have to see the video when I get<BR>
it captured for the full effect.  Stay tuned.<BR>
<BR>
Best,<BR>
Jesse<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Rupert<BR>
Boleyn<BR>
Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999 1:43 PM<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Paintball and morality (was Re: OT/Flamebait ...)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
On 12 Dec 99, at 20:28, Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Oddly enough, Jesse deGraf and I have just returned from visiting Mark<BR>
> Cook in Oregon, where we had the pleasure of attending a full-auto shoot<BR>
> at his gun club.  Coming from California with a fairly strict level of gun<BR>
> control, going 450 miles to find privately owned .50 calibre machine guns<BR>
> a shock.  A *pleasant* shock, but a shock.<BR>
<BR>
I am sooo envious. There are a few full-auto collectors clubs here, but<BR>
they actually get to fire their guns very seldom (you need to be on an<BR>
Army range, with special permission from the police, etc, etc), and the<BR>
meets are very poorly publicised.<BR>
<BR>
Ob Trav: How many Travellers, other than the PCs, go to low Law Level<BR>
worlds just to use/purchase weapons they normally aren't allowed?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Rupert Boleyn <paradise.net.nz><BR>
Wellington, New Zealand<BR>
<BR>
A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #1489<BR>
***********************************<BR>
<BR>
To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR>
<BR>
unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR>
<BR>
in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.imagiconline.com".<BR>
If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>
coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>
address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>
"local-traveller":<BR>
<BR>
subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR>
<BR>
A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>
subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>
in the commands above with "traveller".<BR>
<BR>
Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR>
</XMP></FONT><FONT  COLOR="#0f0f0f" BACK="#fffffe" SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10><BR>
<BR>
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>
Return-Path: <owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Received: from  rly-zd04.mx.aol.com (rly-zd04.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.228]) by air-zd03.mail.aol.com (vx) with ESMTP; Mon, 13 Dec 1999 21:31:01 -0500<BR>
Received: from  lists.imagiconline.com (lists.imagiconline.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zd04.mx.aol.com (v66.4) with ESMTP; Mon, 13 Dec 1999 21:30:27 1900<BR>
Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>
	by lists.imagiconline.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id VAA83208;<BR>
	Mon, 13 Dec 1999 21:17:15 -0500 (EST)<BR>
	(envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com)<BR>
Received: by lists.imagiconline.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Mon, 13 Dec 1999 21:16:53 -0500<BR>
Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>
	by lists.imagiconline.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id VAA83159<BR>
	for traveller-digest-outgoing; Mon, 13 Dec 1999 21:16:53 -0500 (EST)<BR>
	(envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com)<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 21:16:53 -0500 (EST)<BR>
Message-Id: <199912140216.VAA83159@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>
To: traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #1489<BR>
Reply-To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
<BR>
</HTML>
